The Scrumptious Woman

S2 04 Exploring Somatic Healing, Sexuality & Authenticity with Nikki Wetherell

• Juliette Karaman / Nikki Wetherell • Season 2 • Episode 4

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Welcome to The Scrumptious Woman

In this powerful episode, I sit down with Nikki Wetherell, a somatic sexologist and trainee counsellor, for an intimate conversation about trauma, healing, sexuality, and the journey to authenticity. Nikki shares her deeply personal story of navigating sexual trauma, birth trauma, coming out later in life, and exploring polyamory while maintaining a loving marriage and family life.

Episode Summary: 

Nikki opens up about her path to becoming a somatic sexologist and her belief in the power of combining traditional therapy with bodywork. We discuss the importance of safe touch, the wisdom of the body, and how trauma can resurface during significant life events like childbirth. Nikki bravely shares her experience of remembering and processing sexual trauma, and how feeling truly safe for the first time allowed her to explore and acknowledge her queer identity in her late 30s.

Key Takeaways:

  • The vital importance of trusting your body's wisdom and finding practitioners who will listen to and honour that wisdom
  • How feeling safe can unlock deeper understanding of ourselves and our authentic identities
  • The complex journey of coming out later in life while maintaining existing relationships and family dynamics
  • The challenges of navigating polyamory when partners are monogamous
  • The significance of having proper support and poly-informed therapists when exploring non-traditional relationship structures

Nikki reminds us that healing isn't linear - it's more like an infinity sign where we revisit similar themes but with greater awareness each time. Her story beautifully illustrates how authenticity, though challenging, is worth pursuing despite societal conditioning and expectations.

Resources: Connect with Nikki:

If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with anyone who might benefit from hearing this powerful conversation about healing, authenticity, and embracing all parts of ourselves.

 Join me next time, for another taboo-breaking, boundary-pushing episode of The Scrumptious Woman.

Much Love

Juliette x 

Don't forget to Rate and leave a review so more people can tune in and the ripple effect spreads further.

[00:00:00] Juliette Karaman: Welcome to The Scrumptious Woman, the podcast where we speak about everything which is slightly taboo, but also we touch base with what is safe and what has you feel safe in your body. I have with me the most incredible Nikki Wetherill, who is a, I'm gonna let you actually speak because you have so many diplomas and degrees, what do you call yourself these days?

[00:00:23]  Nikki Wetherill: I'm a somatic sexologist and that is My thing really. I am a trainee counsellor and I'm doing that degree with a view to be taking what we do into a bit of a mainstream. So I'm box ticking because I think the power of somatics and that kind of therapy deserves a platform. And I think that the old school way of top up therapy, where it's just talking therapy, isn't really.

[00:00:52]  Nikki Wetherill: Enough. We're holistic beings. Yeah, somatic sexology and sexological body work. And then I've always worked with [00:01:00] energy. I've done my Theta and my Reiki trainings and I don't think I, I would ever switch them off. It didn't matter what I did. Like as soon as you're in a therapeutic process, I think you're, working with energy of the body.

[00:01:14]  Nikki Wetherill: So 

[00:01:15] Juliette Karaman: completely, and I love that where you've just followed the breadcrumbs, 

[00:01:18] Juliette Karaman: right? 

[00:01:19] Juliette Karaman: Oh, this is the next thing. And this is how it's shown up for me. 

[00:01:22]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah. 

[00:01:22] Juliette Karaman: It's Oh, I need to work more of energy. I need to understand that more. The shamanic stuff. 

[00:01:27]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah. 

[00:01:27] Juliette Karaman: More the somatic things. And it's, I think at the basis of it all is for people to feel safe in their body and to be able to move these emotions through and to be able to be with this whole body that we have and create pleasure and have pleasure in it and also have all the emotions that come up.

[00:01:47]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And how people experience that ability to connect and release is going to be different for every person. So having those different threads that you [00:02:00] can pull on. It's like a holistic approach really, isn't it? 

[00:02:03] Juliette Karaman: Love that, yeah. So tell me, we had you on the table earlier and you're someone who's done a lot of work and I know that both you and I, we're real advocates for helping change sexual abuse and the ripple effect that has, not just on you and your family and your children, but also on your children.

[00:02:25] Juliette Karaman: But, the bigger picture, like the rest of the people that get involved, how was it as someone who's so aware of her emotions, her body and everything to receive safe touch? 

[00:02:38]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah, it was great. And I think receiving safe touch when it's one way is a really powerful dynamic to be in, and often it's not.

[00:02:52]  Nikki Wetherill: What anyone has experienced because you're with a partner or someone that's got some kind of emotional [00:03:00] investment or their egos in the room, their emotions, their feelings, their own trauma. Whereas as a practitioner, you park your stuff. Yeah. Obviously you're bringing your whole person, but you're intention is to hold space for me.

[00:03:16]  Nikki Wetherill: And of course you enjoy your work and you love all of that, but it's very different than when you're receiving touch from a partner. 

[00:03:23] Juliette Karaman: And this is a beautiful point that you make. So often we go into a sexual experience, like we both have to enjoy it. And that means there's an exchange. You do this, I then moan, or you do this and I tell you that I like it or I don't like it.

[00:03:41] Juliette Karaman: But if you go into an experience like this where it's actually my job is to read your body, to keep checking in with you what you need. Yeah. And for the body just to guide me and to guide both of us what you need. Yeah. So it's, if you go in with that expectation, it's like I'm going to be in [00:04:00] service, Which brings us like to the BDSM having been a Professional dominatrix is that is really what you're in service of yeah You're in service of that person in front of you with that body in front of you what wants to reveal 

[00:04:13]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah, 100 percent and as you're talking then I was also thinking about the wheel of consent Which is something I work with all the time and how We can, even in a partnership, if we can cultivate a relationship where you really understand the depths of each other's and your needs and you can be in service to your partner without needing to receive or for it to be not for tit for tat or you even out of a therapeutic relationship you can create that but there still is something about having that therapeutic touch that Is, I think it takes you to a whole other place because actually I think it takes a lot to really surrender and be there just for you and not to have to [00:05:00] caretake somebody, which is obviously the other aspect of it.

[00:05:03]  Nikki Wetherill: I 

[00:05:03]  Nikki Wetherill: know I don't have to caretake you in that moment. 

[00:05:06] Juliette Karaman: Completely. 

[00:05:06]  Nikki Wetherill: I'm, yeah. I'm safe and you're their holding space for me. 

[00:05:10] Juliette Karaman: Yeah, and that's a beautiful point that people when they do start playing or when I teach them how to give each other touch, oftentimes like we didn't even speak about this in the container setting because I know what I need and I don't need you to take care of me so that was even cut out but that's definitely a piece that I take my clients through.

[00:05:31] Juliette Karaman: It's The one receiving touch, what do you need? But the one giving touch, what do you need? And oftentimes that kind of gets forgotten. It's okay, maybe I need to go outside, stick my feet in the grass, drink some water, eat some grounding soup, which is what we did. I'm really start thinking about it in that way. When you're giving touch, you are, it's still an energetic exchange. You're getting all that energy and for me it's like I'm reading that body and I'm like super energized [00:06:00] afterwards. A little bit tired. Absolutely. Because I was standing a lot. Yeah. But it's also, you get that energetic exchange.

[00:06:06]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. No, it was great. It was a really nice experience and, I think also there were a lot of, we touched on this earlier therapists and caregivers and people in service still need to be held. So even as even as a coach or a therapist, like it's the reason why in like counseling, you still have to have supervision and your ongoing stuff.

[00:06:30]  Nikki Wetherill: And as, as as therapeutic practitioners, like you still need. And there's still stuff under there, it doesn't matter how much work you do it's like the proverbial fucking onion, isn't it? It's there's always another layer, and it's never Obviously healing isn't linear. It's that spiral and you never go back to the same place, even though sometimes you might be like, why am I revisiting this again?

[00:06:52]  Nikki Wetherill: But yeah, there's always something else. That's what 

[00:06:56] Juliette Karaman: it as an infinity sign. It goes up and down and then you're like, [00:07:00]Oh, we're here again. It's Oh no, I'm a little bit higher. And then, Oh, we're here again. You just get out of the hole quicker. 

[00:07:06]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, developing the self awareness gets you out the hole quicker, doesn't it?

[00:07:11] Juliette Karaman: Completely. 

[00:07:12]  Nikki Wetherill: And working with your nervous system. 

[00:07:14] Juliette Karaman: It's a big one, and I also see where there's There's so much nervous system stuff on the web now and on that we hear in coaching and personal development. And I think, since, what is it, in 95 or so that it really started becoming a big thing.

[00:07:28] Juliette Karaman: It's last 20, 20 odd years or so that it's become more, maybe even less. Steven Porges work. 

[00:07:35]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah, the polyvagal theory. 

[00:07:36] Juliette Karaman: The polyvagal theory. But really recognizing that is, we are, our bodies are just. In that, we can get into the fight, we can get into the fight, we can get into fun and recognizing it's nothing to be ashamed of.

[00:07:50] Juliette Karaman: It's something that you can start to recognize, it's something that you can start to work through. And have someone hold space. Yourself hold space for you, but also what are the [00:08:00] ways that we can just be with it. So yeah, it's a good point. 

[00:08:03]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah, I really like what you just said about yourself holding space for you.

[00:08:06]  Nikki Wetherill: Because I think there's a fine line between going out and you can go and do all of the therapies and all of the things, but actually you have to also learn to be your own resource and to regulate yourself and working with people like you're teaching people these tools so that they can go away and learn them and be them.

[00:08:29]  Nikki Wetherill: You don't want someone 

[00:08:30] Juliette Karaman: codependent, you don't want someone just to come back to you because every time they can't do it themselves it's no let's teach you this so that you after seeing me twice three four times whatever yes I do have people that saved me longer but you can go out this and do this or you can become your own expert and have the people they get the ripple effect.

[00:08:48]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah that's what and I've always said I'm not here to hold you as a client and to keep you. I want to teach you how you can fly. Completely. And hold yourself. Like that's [00:09:00] empowerment. That's the work, I think. I think it's a bit of an old paradigm of, wanting to keep people stuck in a loop of consuming.

[00:09:09] Juliette Karaman: Completely. And I think if you think about the coaching and the therapy world, it's similar and not quite. And then you get the difference saying, oh, but she's a therapist, but she's a coach. And then it's she's a coach and a therapist. It's oh, where does it cross over? Where does it not?

[00:09:23] Juliette Karaman: And it's You know what? Actually, we don't have to have a weekly schedule that you come back and are in someone's care. Some people might, may need that at that point. But then it's okay, time to go. Time to fly. Tell me, you have kids and a family and coming out and Being a somatic sexologist, being on your whole journey where you remembered your rape, all of a sudden that came out, where that opened a whole way of being, of finding out about your [00:10:00] sexuality, about maybe it's even gender stuff that's coming out.

[00:10:04] Juliette Karaman: Take me on that journey a little bit, if you want. 

[00:10:06]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah, no, it's a big one. I think I, I knew I remembered the rape and I spent a long time trying to push it down. I never quite managed it. It was always there, but I think it was when I had my son, who's now 18, that really started to bubble up.

[00:10:28]  Nikki Wetherill: Which was 95. I can't work the numbers out, but I was 15 when it happened and I was 26 when I had Toby, so whatever those numbers are. And when I had him while I, my birth didn't quite go as I wanted it to, I wanted a home birth, I was forced into going into hospital.

[00:10:46] Juliette Karaman: Okay, so that's already against your will, that's already a bit of a traumatic thing. 

[00:10:51]  Nikki Wetherill: And it wasn't because Something was wrong. They basically, my hindwaters had gone and they were insistent [00:11:00] that I needed to go into hospital because and in their words, if I didn't, he was going to die. But actually that wasn't the case because in all the monitoring, he was fine.

[00:11:09]  Nikki Wetherill: It was a bit of a, and this might be controversial and everyone has to do what's right for them. But the NHS have to We have, they have to make sure we're okay and it doesn't really matter what cost of that is. And what I learned afterwards was I could have asked for more monitoring and stuff like that.

[00:11:28]  Nikki Wetherill: This started my journey on realizing I hadn't been listening to my body because everything in my body was like, do not go to hospital. You don't need to go to hospital. Your baby's fine. The monitor's fine. You're like, everything is fine. I was actually having contractions. If I'd sat around for another couple of days, perhaps done some some stuff that helps move things along, I would have probably gone into labour naturally as it was.

[00:11:53]  Nikki Wetherill: I then was induced. I said to them, I'm going to go into labour really quickly. And they went, no, you're [00:12:00] not. You haven't had a baby before. You don't know what you're talking about. And I'm like, I'm feeling this so like primally in my body. It was a real primal knowing. Yeah. No, you're not.

[00:12:10]  Nikki Wetherill: You'll still be here this time tomorrow. Within 20 minutes of the pessary, I was in full blown labour, but they'd sent my partner home and they refused to call him back, and I ended up being on my own for seven hours in the most hideous labour. I was couldn't do anything because it was such, so strong.

[00:12:28]  Nikki Wetherill: I couldn't get my phone to call him or, and eventually I was like, I need to push. And they they were like, no, you don't, no, you don't. I was like, I need to push. And all I kept hearing was no one's checking on me just through the curtain. No, you don't. And then eventually I made enough noise. Someone came in and I got this really like rude kind of hand shoved inside me.

[00:12:48]  Nikki Wetherill: I almost fell off the bed cause they were so aggressive. Yeah. And then someone went, Shit, she's 7cm, get her to delivery. At which point I was put in a lift with a male [00:13:00] porter wearing nothing but a t shirt. And I was given pethidine, which made it feel like I did in the rape. It was the first time I'd ever drunk alcohol when I was raped.

[00:13:08]  Nikki Wetherill: And I was in and out of consciousness at the time it was happening. And the pethidine So I was now on my own, I'd not been listened to, I was in a lift with a guy, I didn't know him. I couldn't really work out what was going on because I kept dropping out of consciousness and suddenly I'm then on a table being given an epidural and then my husband turned up.

[00:13:29]  Nikki Wetherill: What was going on? And I'm a complete mess. And then after I had Toby, 

[00:13:34] Juliette Karaman: say it 

[00:13:39]  Nikki Wetherill: was a lot, there was a lot of not listening to my body and not being. understanding that I knew the wisdom of my body and I trusted that. But these people in authority were telling me I was wrong. And so there was this dynamic playing out, which I think I've noticed a [00:14:00] lot of the years in healthcare.

[00:14:01]  Nikki Wetherill: And actually I think one of the most important lessons I certainly teach my clients is to trust the wisdom of your body because you know your body better than anybody. And the body 

[00:14:11] Juliette Karaman: actually does give you the signs, right? If the head listened to you saying I'm about to push. Yeah, that means it's Let's go and check on her.

[00:14:17] Juliette Karaman: Exactly. So this ends up going on. You remember the rape, all of a sudden things 

[00:14:22]  Nikki Wetherill: became clear again. After that, I just I was really hyper aware of how that, that those dynamics started to play out in my life where I wasn't being listened to, where my body, I wasn't trusting my body and that kind of thing.

[00:14:35]  Nikki Wetherill: Anyway, long journey forwards. I had my daughter. I had an amazing home birth. I had a private midwife which obviously is a privilege to be able to do that. I recognize that although I really didn't have much money at the time, it was a priority. It was really cathartic to do that. And suddenly I was like, this is what it feels like to trust your body and to do what it's meant to do.

[00:14:57]  Nikki Wetherill: It was actually a few years later. When [00:15:00] Naya was one I moved and that was when the rape trauma really kicked in. And that was when I had to tell my husband what happened.

[00:15:08]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah. So that started the process of, I can't hide this anymore, I can't keep it in. I remember after I had Toby, I did try and tell somebody and, because it had bubbled up and caused a lot of postnatal depression and stuff. But really it was after I had Naya, I then, I ended up moving to a place where I then couldn't avoid.

[00:15:29]  Nikki Wetherill: It was in my face all the time. And I've said before for legal reasons, I can't explain more than that. But it was in my face and indirectly but still there. And it was a constant trigger, like the whole time. 

[00:15:41] Juliette Karaman: Constant reminder of what, what happened. Yeah. 

[00:15:43]  Nikki Wetherill: Where are you? 

[00:15:44] Juliette Karaman: Couldn't say no. Yeah, 

[00:15:46]  Nikki Wetherill: exactly.

[00:15:46]  Nikki Wetherill: I was then back in that point where I couldn't say no. And yeah, I just, I ended up having a nervous breakdown. I did nine months in the Priory. After then was when I got into, so it was, yeah, 2010 I started training as [00:16:00] a personal trainer and doing, that's when like the connecting with the body and I didn't realize then I was taught somatically.

[00:16:06]  Nikki Wetherill: But then I started doing the energy work. I received a lot as part of my recovery and my healing. And then I started to train in that as well. And all of these like little layers came in, but then it wasn't until 10 years later. that I realized I was queer. So I was like, was 38. I had a very heteronormative life.

[00:16:31]  Nikki Wetherill: I hadn't two children, got married, picket fence life, amazing marriage. Like my husband is incredible, such a support. And but, I'd had these thoughts for a while, like I kept thinking about women and I thought that maybe everyone thought about women that way or I would fantasize about them a lot.

[00:16:57]  Nikki Wetherill: And I started diving into [00:17:00] like programs. So I'd go out and do my cardio and I'd watch on my iPad, like the L word or you, me, her, which is a program about polyamorous relationship or like films with LGBTQ themes. And I was trying to understand, was this like a fantasy? Like, why could I not escape it?

[00:17:20]  Nikki Wetherill: And actually it was the first time in life I'd ever felt safe. I dealt with my trauma. I, you. I wasn't confronted with it regularly. And for the first time I felt safe. Suddenly I was like Fuck, I'm not straight. 

[00:17:34] Juliette Karaman: Oh, I can now explore different avenues. Yeah, 

[00:17:36]  Nikki Wetherill: and that literally was it.

[00:17:38]  Nikki Wetherill: The moment I realized that I was safe I then, I was working at a retreat in Ibiza and there was someone there that was openly bisexual and with no shame about it. Importantly, there was no shame about the fact that they were attracted to different genders. Yeah. And that was the first time also I'd seen that, because when I was at school I remember someone saying to me once, you're such a lesbian, [00:18:00] and like the retraction in me or like people using gay as a slur, or my parents didn't have any Gay friends until I was much older and then they only had, what, I think, one person.

[00:18:11]  Nikki Wetherill: So I hadn't really, 

[00:18:12] Juliette Karaman: like It wasn't in your No. In your arena. It just wasn't in your 

[00:18:16]  Nikki Wetherill: No. It wasn't. I didn't. I lived in a Although I grew up in London I moved to the country and there was, I know there was a couple of gay women in a village as a teenager, but when I saw them in the pub you'd hear the So it just wasn't safe to be that.

[00:18:30]  Nikki Wetherill: And then this person was so owning it and it felt And I went and chatted to her and I was like, I've got to tell you, you're the first person I feel like I can say this to, but I think I've got a thing for women and I don't know what to do about it. And she was like, Great. And I was just like, 

[00:18:48] Juliette Karaman: Isn't it nice when you get that, it's not even that you're looking for approval, but it's that.

[00:18:55] Juliette Karaman: space. Yeah. Actually finding a safe space where you can be like, Oh, [00:19:00] yeah, I have this curiosity. I want to start exploring. What do I do with this? Yeah. Actually just knowing that you're not the only one out there. Yeah. This is and really think about the need to have Renee Brown says, like the empathy that other people have gone through this too.

[00:19:16]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah. I think there's two things. One, obviously things have changed, although certainly not enough. And in this political climate, there's a lot of trans stuff that's coming up which feels like we're going backwards. But the, I think that there's some kind of also privilege in some, for some people, and this might sound clunky, but there has to be a sense of safety.

[00:19:39]  Nikki Wetherill: To come out, or sometimes people are outed not safely, and obviously that's really traumatic.

[00:19:49]  Nikki Wetherill: You have to somehow, reconcile in yourself. that it's okay to do this or find that acceptance in yourself. Like for me, I [00:20:00] had to learn to accept who I was, and that was outside the conditioning that I was brought up with. Or whether it was societal because any kind of minority is slightly tokenism.

[00:20:13]  Nikki Wetherill: There's an aspect of tokenism in media. Or, I don't know, just, yeah, just general conditioning of how you come up. And it, I think everything comes back to safety, doesn't it? Whether it's body work, whether it's coming to self acceptance, there's finding that. And actually sometimes it doesn't feel safe, but it's, at the times I haven't felt safe, I've had to find an anchor in myself that actually that was more important.

[00:20:37]  Nikki Wetherill: Being authentic is more important than that choose your hard thing, 

[00:20:42] Juliette Karaman: but that's the beauty right, where we can bring it back to a place where we actually feel It's so important to be authentic. And yes, if we bring it back to safety, like safety, let's first talk about having your house and having your food and having all of that taken care of.

[00:20:57] Juliette Karaman: Because if we don't have those physical [00:21:00] or those base needs taken care of, we can't even go to the emotional layers and like even trying to figure out what might've happened. 

[00:21:09]  Nikki Wetherill: Even like religious wise, like for so many people growing up in. Cultures where it's not okay extra hard and yeah, I think it's just important to acknowledge that privilege that some people can come out and some can't. There's still, what, like 72 countries in the world or something where it's not legal to be. 

[00:21:31] Juliette Karaman: That's so many. 

[00:21:31]  Nikki Wetherill: Yes. I forget the actual numbers. I don't know if it's 60, 64 somewhere between 60 and 70 countries 

[00:21:38] Juliette Karaman: around the world. It's still a big deal. 

[00:21:40]  Nikki Wetherill: Yeah. 

[00:21:41] Juliette Karaman: I know in a place like Lebanon it's okay, I think there's still not gay marriage, right?

[00:21:45] Juliette Karaman: There are a lot of places that is quite new. All right, so I'm going to take it back to you a little bit. Your two kids, your husband, you're coming out like bisexual, gay, queer? What do you, does it even need a [00:22:00] label? Or it's Hey, I'm, I love you as my husband, I love my children, and I have this other thing going on.

[00:22:06]  Nikki Wetherill: Really funnily, my best friend sent me a screenshot of a message I sent to her. So we had a mutual friend, we didn't really know each other very well, but just through this mutual friend, and When we both came out within a few months of each other to this friend, and she was like, you need to talk to Emma, you need to talk to Nick.

[00:22:27]  Nikki Wetherill: And so we ended up like messaging each other. And she sent me this message that I was obviously explaining where I was at. And it said yeah, I've realized I'm bisexual but I'm definitely more into men than women. And that was like five years ago. And. Over the last five years I came to realize that's really not the case and that actually My husband's incredible.

[00:22:54]  Nikki Wetherill: I absolutely adore him He's been an absolute rock, amazing support, [00:23:00] amazing father my best friend And it's because he is who he is that I have a relationship with him and that the body is You but there's also this like he, I remember about a year ago we were out for dinner on New Year's and he was like, Oh, where are you on the spectrum?

[00:23:22]  Nikki Wetherill: I'm thinking about 60 percent into men. And I was like, ah, no up. And I think that was a really big thing. Realizing that actually I was way down the spectrum, the other direction. And And, it's messy and it's complex and it's hard to unlearn all of this stuff around what I'm told my sexuality should be or where it falls.

[00:23:47]  Nikki Wetherill: And, it's tough to try and unpack that and learn it. And it feels really raw and vulnerable and still in the middle of it. And it's been, there's been times when it's been. [00:24:00]Great and really fun and there's been times when actually it's really hard and right now I'm in a really hard bit of it and I'm not gonna sit here and pretend like it's all sunshine and roses because it's not we're going through the trenches right now of exploring that and how that impacts us.

[00:24:17]  Nikki Wetherill: And then I have a part, another partner. After I came out, I realized that it wasn't something I wanted to explore with my husband as part of swinging or threesomes. That's a whole other thing. I wanted to be able to explore it on my own. So I'd started dating women on my own. And we did, go to clubs and have a great time together. but not with women. It was very much us. And then I dated outside of that. And that I also started to then develop my relationship with my body further and realize that where I felt like I perhaps been dysphoric in the past, I always had this thing where I wanted to be straight. I'm quite naturally quite curvy and I wanted to be straight.

[00:24:58]  Nikki Wetherill: And I thought I wanted to be [00:25:00] straight because in the nineties, it was like the Kate Moss 

[00:25:02]  Nikki Wetherill: weight thing and that you had to be really thin, but actually. I wanted to be straight like a boy. Boys aren't curvy. And I started to realise I had this more masculine energy in me that I really enjoy. And it's around, like I use they she pronouns now.

[00:25:22]  Nikki Wetherill: And it's fluid and it moves and so that was that. And then I met my partner Hayley last summer and completely fell for her. And And it's amazing with her and great and it fills me up and also there's these two worlds, it's like how do you navigate being sometimes I think am I polyamorous because I came out later in life and I adore my life.

[00:25:50]  Nikki Wetherill: And also there's this other bit of me that's completely in love with my girlfriend. She's moving like halfway across the country to be closer to me and we're just in this really messy phase of [00:26:00] Life? Life, yeah. And life outside the social norms and constructs. It's fucking hard. 

[00:26:06] Juliette Karaman: It's tough, right?

[00:26:08] Juliette Karaman: It's really tough. I remember when I was leading this conscious sexuality program or movement in London and this was after I'd gotten divorced and after I'd been with a man with three other kids, so after two, two really big relationships. And all of a sudden it was like, Oh women are interesting.

[00:26:29] Juliette Karaman: And that's Oh, and there's lots of other men. So I became polyamorous and it was, that was hard work because there's the the conditioning, first of all, and we talked about that. And then also what does everyone else think? 

[00:26:42] Juliette Karaman: My parents thought I was crazy. My kids are like, what the hell, mommy?

[00:26:46] Juliette Karaman: What are you doing? Yeah. To recognize it's I'm exploring, right? And it might not be comfortable for you, but what I'm doing, doesn't have. A direct impact, or I thought it doesn't have a [00:27:00] direct impact, and obviously the ripple does have an impact. So it's oh, maybe I was a bit colorblind there or toned deaf, but really recognizing it's oh, I really wanted to just play around in that and then feel what feels good.

[00:27:13] Juliette Karaman: So I so get what you're going through. 

[00:27:16]  Nikki Wetherill: I think I am in a relationship with two monogamous people. 

[00:27:20] Juliette Karaman: Yes. 

[00:27:21]  Nikki Wetherill: And although I've unpacked lots of the conditioning around monogamy, they're also having to do it at the same time as I've got all of this stuff coming up about my sexuality. You just don't realize how much of monogamous conditioning informs how you behave in relationships and what expectations are like the relationship escalator of like how things progress. It's a lot, it's a lot. It's worth it for the authenticity. But it's a lot. 

[00:27:51] Juliette Karaman: Thank you for being so open. Thank you for being, for sharing everything and really showing that there's [00:28:00] not just one way. There's not one way to just be authentic and to be yourself. So what I'd love you to do is share with us how people can get a hold of you.

[00:28:08] Juliette Karaman: If they're going through maybe this transition, maybe they're Oh, how can I even start exploring this? How can I start looking at this with my husband? Because I know that if you go through counseling, you may not always get the right counselors, so yeah, maybe they wanna talk to you, maybe you have a program.

[00:28:28] Juliette Karaman: How do people get in contact with you? 

[00:28:29]  Nikki Wetherill: So you can find me on Instagram at Celestial Soul Coach, or my website is celestial soul.co.uk. And yeah, I would say if you are in this position and you are working with a therapist, just make sure that they are. either experienced in polyamory or poly informed at the very least, but just to ask them about how they're breaking down their biases around it because sometimes they're sneaky and they creep in and it can impact the therapeutic relationship.

[00:28:58]  Nikki Wetherill: So yeah, drop me a [00:29:00] message, email me. Yeah. Beautiful. 

[00:29:02] Juliette Karaman: Thank you so much for being here. Thank you my love. Pleasure. And that was another episode of The Scrumptious Woman. Please share this with whoever feel, you feel that can listen to this and really it can have that ripple. They can profit from it. See you next time.

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Juliette Karaman

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